User talk:Jeancey/Ije

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Ije	Caco

Weapons VendorsEdit

Do you happen to remember making any edits similar to this? We now have a separate list for those Weapons vendors. —Legoless (talk) 19:12, 7 April 2015 (GMT)

I remember that I was surprised that it was his store type in game. I don't remember seeing ANYONE else, but I haven't been to DC yet. Jeancey (talk) 19:13, 7 April 2015 (GMT)

If the two we've found so far are anything to go by, they seem to only show up at unmarked stores. —Legoless (talk) 19:17, 7 April 2015 (GMT)

Loremaster's ArchiveEdit

Hey Jeancey, you might want to weigh in on this. —Legoless (talk) 16:02, 4 May 2015 (GMT)

XBoxEdit

Oh, you're not done yet! :P The list excludes all talk pages and user space, and I manually removed a few obvious CP, AN, and similar type entries. Don't hate me. ;) – Robin Hood ^(talk) 00:59, 7 May 2015 (GMT)

XBox

AzumEdit

Do you happen to remember who this is? Azum is also the name of a male Khajiit in Reaper's March. —Legoless (talk) 13:23, 15 May 2015 (GMT)

Are you sure they are male? The only game data in the ESOlog is for a female Azum. The Argonian might be a mistake (I was c/ping pretty heavily at the time I edited the article). There seems to be 4 copies of Azum, all the same level, which indicated its the same person who just moves around a bit. But our data definitely says female. Where is the Male Khajiit located in Reaper's March? Jeancey (talk) 16:44, 15 May 2015 (GMT)

He's the questgiver for Hadran's Caravan; for me he appeared above Weeping Wind Cave. He was definitely male, but the quest is about rescuing his husband from Hadran so who knows. Maybe Azum isn't his full name? —Legoless (talk) 16:59, 15 May 2015 (GMT)

The Khajiit I'm thinking of is actually Sind. No idea who Azum is, or why we have her listed in the quest stages. —Legoless (talk) 17:02, 15 May 2015 (GMT)

(edit conflict) There are multiple gay characters in game, female characters who reference their wives and male characters who reference their husbands, so just asking you to help rescue his husband doesn't mean he isn't male. I'll look into it. There is Azum's Journal which references the caravan, so she might still be there. Jeancey (talk) 17:03, 15 May 2015 (GMT)

Title CapitalisationEdit

Hey, I noticed that you changed the start of a shop name to lowercase. I've changed it back, since it's the title of a shop rather than a literal fungus (e.g. "The Daily Mirror" vs "the Mirror"). Thought I should point it out in case you happen to have done it anywhere else. :) —Legoless (talk) 23:32, 21 May 2015 (GMT)

NPC Variable GenderEdit

I don't see the need for these to be categorised, eg "Online-Argonian-Variable Gender‏‎". If you agree can you tweak the summary to stop categorising them. Silence is Golden^{Break the Silence} 21:34, 22 May 2015 (UTC)

You're Old!Edit

I just don't know how old. Based on your edit summary, I'm guessing about three. :P Happy...ummm..."birfbirf". – Robin Hood ^(talk) 07:35, 24 May 2015 (UTC)

Have a good one, pal! Zul do onikaan^{Laan tinvaak} 10:04, 24 May 2015 (UTC)

Cheers! :) ~Shuryard (talk) 13:51, 24 May 2015 (UTC)

Happy birthday! —Legoless (talk) 14:34, 24 May 2015 (UTC)

Happy birthday, my good sir! Now don't get too sloshed... •WoahBro^►talk 16:36, 24 May 2015 (UTC)

Happy birthday! Make sure you don't go under-sloshed, either. Insignificant Revisions^{Threats•Evidence} 18:45, 24 May 2015 (UTC)

Thanks guys!!!! Jeancey (talk) 20:10, 25 May 2015 (UTC)

And a belated Happy Birfbirf from me! :) Holomay (talk) 21:32, 25 May 2015 (UTC)

SandboxesEdit

Your sandboxes Chay and Yaayin and their doc pages are in the template categories, long after both have been taken live. Can you remove them from the categories please. Silence is Golden^{Break the Silence} 00:36, 30 May 2015 (UTC)

Yeah, that's fine. I'll do it when I get back to my computer. Is that why you blanked those other sandboxes? Jeancey (talk) 02:15, 30 May 2015 (UTC)

Yes. Silence is Golden^{Break the Silence} 02:05, 30 May 2015 (UTC)

Honestly I would have left this message on everyone's sandbox rather than just blanking. Then, give them a few weeks, then blank it. The extra category really isn't a pressing issue, so there isn't a pressing reason why they needed to be blanked now. That might just be my opinion though. Changing a page in someone else's users pace is a touchy subject though. Jeancey (talk) 02:15, 30 May 2015 (UTC)

They are not pressing, but if they are allowed to fester they eventually start to clog up areas. Touching user pages is touchy, which is why inactive users get blanked and notified and active users get a message asking them to sort their own pages out. Why now is simply a matter of me becoming active again, it would have been done much earlier if someone else was maintaining categories. Silence is Golden^{Break the Silence} 02:27, 30 May 2015 (UTC)

ESO Console ChatEdit

Hey there, since you are Guildmaster of the NA XB1 guild I assume you have ESO on console :P Would you be able to help out with the revamp of Online:Chat? We need details on the different Voice Chat channels, a full list of Emote categories and the emotes included within them, and (eventually) the Emote actions that are connected to each Quick Chat phrase. Please and thank you! --Enodoc (talk) 10:49, 10 June 2015 (UTC)

There are a TON. There are 11 Categories, each with between 12 and 27 emotes. I'll start typing.... It'll be on the talk page though, you'll have to format it for the page :P Jeancey (talk) 18:15, 10 June 2015 (UTC)

That's fine by me, dump it wherever. Much appreciated, thanks! --Enodoc (talk) 19:37, 10 June 2015 (UTC)

Quest IconsEdit

Hey there, another console question! I'm looking to integrate the Quest Type Icons that were datamined into the Online Quest Header, as I believe they appear in the Journal in the console versions. While most of them are self-explanatory, I was wondering if you'd be able to let me know which quests appear with the Dungeon icon , and which appear with the Group icon , as the quests previously considered Dungeon quests are all Group quests, and the icon datamined for Dungeon quests is the Public Dungeon icon rather than the Group Dungeon icon, and all Public Dungeon quests have previously been considered Normal quests. Thanks! --Enodoc (talk) 09:58, 16 June 2015 (UTC)

I'll try to get around to it this weekend. I haven't have much time to do much of anything (hence my more lurking mode on the wiki the past two weeks). I should have time to check this out in the next few days though. If not, I know ME and SCarverOrne both play on Xbox, you could try seeing if they can check on things for you. Jeancey (talk) 14:38, 17 June 2015 (UTC)

Missed your IRC callEdit

Sorry I missed you, man. What was it you needed? Send me an email and I'll get to you soon as I can. -damon ^{talk ♥ contribs} 04:55, 26 June 2015 (UTC)

Bolding (Again)Edit

This has come up again on Lore:Whisper Grove, to quote: "bold should really only be in the first sentence, especially for alternate names". This may appear to be the rule, since placing a bolded term at the top is usually going to be the best place for it to go. However, in this case "City of Ash" is being bolded because it's a target of a redirect, under Wikipedia's principle of WP:LEAST. Essentially, as long as a reader is not confused by being redirected—i.e., as long as they can clearly see the redirect term bolded—then they know they're in the right place. Since Whisper Grove is such a short article, bolding the redirect term in the second paragraph isn't a problem. Of course, moving the term to the top of the page is arguably a better solution here, but moving it there out of context with the rest of the article is not, which is why I chose to place it further down the page. I believe this is enough to address any potential confusion, but I figured I'd point out the underlying stylistic rationale all the same since I went to the trouble of researching this a while back. —Legoless (talk) 02:24, 3 July 2015 (UTC)

Out of curiosityEdit

So, where do you get some of the Online data like NPC races (when they're not obvious by looking), level (when not listed like Hamza) and health? Is there a CS of sorts or some way to view data like that in-game? Schiffy^(Talk) 20:36, 18 August 2015 (UTC)

Various add-ons can display the health and level of an NPC in-game, yes. I personally use Factory Tactical Combat, which displays the health of all npcs when you look at them. Jeancey (talk) 21:02, 18 August 2015 (UTC)

I should poke around the Nexus for more than just map marker mods. Anyway, on a completely unrelated note, is there a reason stuff in the Online namespace doesn't show up so readily in the search bar? Schiffy^(Talk) 21:23, 18 August 2015 (UTC)

It's not just Online namespace stuff - the search bar doesn't contain any results for any pages created after January 2013. What's Nexus like for ESO mods? I exclusively use ESOUI for the ones I use; Srendarr Buff Tracker and Azurah Interface Enhanced are among my favourites. Haven't found one that shows NPC race though. --Enodoc (talk) 22:15, 18 August 2015 (UTC)

If that search bar issue is a feature and not an MW bug, it's an odd one.

I haven't bothered with the Nexus Mod Manager for ESO, but the site itself has a few interesting things (the first two I got were map markers for undiscovered Skyshards and Lorebooks). The FTC version on Nexus was outdated so I had to go to the author's site for it, but other than that it's pretty standard if you're looking for a UI mod, I guess. Schiffy^(Talk) 22:38, 18 August 2015 (UTC)

Dunmer Families and Ancestral TombsEdit

Hi. You recently spoke to another user about guidelines for adding related family members to articles. Judging by that message, you may want to have a look at nearly every Morrowind:Ancestral Tombs article. They seem to have become de facto lists of every Dunmer in every game, ever, who had that name.

I had thought I remembered reading some guideline article here that said that gamespace articles should be written to describe the world as it was at the time of that game, and it was with that in mind that I recently removed a 4th-era name from Morrowind:Sarys Ancestral Tomb. After that edit was undone, I looked at other articles and saw that nearly all had mentions of Dunmer from all games since Morrowind. As this was apparently the new standard and as I couldn't find any guideline article like I thought I had remembered, I didn't try any further to assert my viewpoint.

I wonder whether you know of any guideline article like the one I mentioned. Does such an article exist, or did I possibly imagine it together from pieces of other guidelines? Also I'd like to ask your opinion of what should be done with the ancestral tomb articles. Should mentions of characters from other games be removed? Should ALL characters be removed unless they imply a connection to that tomb? Should only names from later games be removed (and would ESO constitute an earlier or later game)? Should the articles be left as they are? Or something else entirely?

Thanks for reading this. 99.36.122.114 02:05, 8 September 2015 (UTC)

Essentially what happened was that when Oblivion and Skyrim came out, someone ended up adding the names to the Morrowind tomb pages. Some time after Skyrim came out, it was pointed out that we would just be continuously adding names to pages that really had no relevance to the content of the page. At this point, the current info on the tomb pages is grandfathered in and shouldn't be removed, but neither should new names be added. Just leave the names sections as they are, though the other parts of the page such as the description of the tomb itself can of course be improved if needed. Hopefully that clears things up. Let me know if you are still confused on one or two aspects, as it is a confusing situation. Jeancey (talk) 20:56, 8 September 2015 (UTC)

A lot of names have been added just recently. --Holomay (talk) 21:34, 8 September 2015 (UTC)

I would honestly just remove those. It's better to JUST have the names that were on the pages prior to the release of ESO. Jeancey (talk) 22:28, 8 September 2015 (UTC)

It's probably time to just bite the bullet and remove all names that aren't from Morrowind. Lore:Dunmer Names is the place to note repeating names, not gamespace place pages. Could be added as a MWOP task maybe? —Legoless (talk) 22:35, 8 September 2015 (UTC)

Oh, if we're getting rid of those at last, I'll do it myself later tonight! I've been complaining about those for a couple of years now, and I'd be more than happy to be the one that finally sees all those non-Morrowind names off the pages! -damon ^{talk ♥ contribs} 22:43, 8 September 2015 (UTC)

(←) Alright, I didn't do it last night like I said I would, but it's finally done, and I can happily say my biggest pet peeve with regards to the Morrowind namespace has now been taken care of! Sorry for breaking the Recent Changes page, though. :( -damon ^{talk ♥ contribs} 22:11, 9 September 2015 (UTC)

Idona StronswordEdit

Hey Jeancey! You've created the page of Idona Stronsword as a NPC. Is there really a mention of her anywhere, or was it just a typo meant to be Idona Strongsword? -- SarthesArai ^Talk 11:45, 22 November 2015 (UTC)

A little late, but I would bet on either the typo being mine, or a typo from the game that was eventually fixed. Either way, I'd say it's a typo. :P Jeancey (talk) 06:40, 30 December 2015 (UTC)

Morkuldin ForgeEdit

Just wondering, are these people located in the same area as Orzorga? Because the Morkuldin Forge is actually a sealed crafting site at the bottom of the cliff, below that settlement. —Legoless (talk) 05:06, 2 January 2016 (UTC)

Yeah, they are, but there really isn't any other name for that settlement. That's one of the reasons I put it as loc instead of settlement, because they aren't really located in a settlement, but outside the ruins of the crafting site. Feel free to change it if I just missed a name for that place. Jeancey (talk) 05:08, 2 January 2016 (UTC)

There's no name for it as far as I can tell, but it's definitely not the Forge, which can only be accessed from this quest. Even though the map marker appears to be nearby, the actual entrance is pretty far away unless you wanna suicide off the side of the cliff to get there. —Legoless (talk) 05:13, 2 January 2016 (UTC)

Well, we need a name. I guess we could call it the Old Fort, since that is the name of two of the interior zones... Jeancey (talk) 05:14, 2 January 2016 (UTC)

I was thinking Old Fort or Orzorga's Kitchen but they're probably better off as Building pages. We could just make up a name if we have to, since it's a pretty important place to leave unmarked. I guess we could call it Old Fort (settlement) to give naming preference to the building or something, and make a note that it has no in-game name. —Legoless (talk) 05:20, 2 January 2016 (UTC)

I haven't spent much time actually talking to the people, I just created pages for them. Is it possible that their dialog could provide a clue to a name? Jeancey (talk) 05:21, 2 January 2016 (UTC)

I don't think so, most of it was just comments about the various dishes you help make. Worth taking a look though, maybe some of the vendors have something to say. Pretty sure all the quests just refer to "Orzorga" without mentioning any place name. —Legoless (talk) 05:24, 2 January 2016 (UTC)

What about any quests directing you to Orzorga? Jeancey (talk) 05:25, 2 January 2016 (UTC)

Same deal, if I remember correctly. I was trying to keep an eye out for a name as well, so I'm almost positive we're screwed for a name. That's the main reason I didn't include it on the Wrothgar place list when I went through it. —Legoless (talk) 05:28, 2 January 2016 (UTC)

Well then. I say we go with Old Fort (settlement). Or Orzorga's Kitchen (settlement) might work to... Jeancey (talk) 05:30, 2 January 2016 (UTC)

(←) I went and had a look, and the two interiors are actually labelled 'Old Tower' and are literally ruined towers. That seems more like a descriptor than anything. The NPCs keep talking about how it's great that the ruins have been repurposed as a rare safehaven for travellers, but no names are given. Since Orzorga's Kitchen is the only labelled service there, I think we should go with that as the article name. The only alternative I can see is merging it with Forlorn Watchtower since they're almost the same complex, but a separate page seems best. —Legoless (talk) 01:32, 3 January 2016 (UTC)

Sounds good to me! Jeancey (talk) 01:36, 3 January 2016 (UTC)

It's up. —Legoless (talk) 01:57, 3 January 2016 (UTC)

The problem with Online NPC SummaryEdit

Per your edit summary here, I think the problem is in the code of {{Online NPC Summary}}. {{NeedsImage}} is supposed to be added by {{Parameter Check}}, but Parameter Check is not working properly. There are two #if-defines which I think are supposed to do something dependent on whether the "creature" parameter exists or not, but they do not seem to be syntactically sound. I tried to fix it myself, but I'm not entirely sure what the code is supposed to do.

The problem with NeedsImage exists in this chunk:

{{#if:{{{creature|{{Parameter Check|type=NPC}}}}}||{{Parameter Check|type=Creature}}}}

The #if syntax is {{#if:something|then|else}}, so my guess for what it should look like is:

{{#if:{{{creature|}}}|{{Parameter Check|type=Creature}}|{{Parameter Check|type=NPC}}}}

There's another chunk with the same syntax, presumably causing something else to not work properly:

{{#if:{{{creature|{{#inittrail:People|ifnot={{{notrail|}}}}}
{{#addtotrail:Vendors|separator=' / '|if={{{sells|}}}}}
{{#addtotrail:[[{{NS_FULL}}Transport#{{{transport}}}|Transport]]|separator=' / '|if={{{transport|}}}
}}
}}}|{{#inittrail:Creatures|if={{{creature|}}}
}}
}}

But I got a bit confused about what is supposed to happen in each instance since my fix is the other way around. I think it should be:

{{#if:{{{creature|}}}|{{#inittrail:Creatures|if={{{creature|}}}}}|{{#inittrail:People|ifnot={{{notrail|}}}}}
{{#addtotrail:Vendors|separator=' / '|if={{{sells|}}}}}
{{#addtotrail:[[{{NS_FULL}}Transport#{{{transport}}}|Transport]]|separator=' / '|if={{{transport|}}}}}
}}

I hope that makes sense, and I hope that helps fix the problem! --Enodoc (talk) 11:16, 5 January 2016 (UTC)

The {{{creature|Something}}} part basically means that if it isn't a creature, it does "Something". So {{#if:{{{creature|{{#inittrail:People|ifnot={{{notrail|}}}}} says that if it isn't a creature, it adds People to the trail, as long as notrail=/=1. That part is perfectly fine, there really isn't an issue there. The first part you wrote is just setting the parameter type. If creature is defined, then nothing. If creature is not defined, it defines the type as NPC. I don't see where the problem with needsimage is coming from if the issue is really in that part of the code. Jeancey (talk) 11:28, 5 January 2016 (UTC)

So I moved some things around because I think the issue was that the pipe was in the wrong place, and then I added a parameter check, but I'm fairly certain it is just redundant. It seems to work fine now, except that any NPC page with the needsimage template will now display two banners instead of one. Jeancey (talk) 11:36, 5 January 2016 (UTC)

(edit conflict) No it doesn't; perhaps Robin could explain it better, but {{{creature|Something}}} means nothing in an #if definition, only in template parameter construction to define a default value. By itself, {{{creature|Something}}} will output "Something" as default if creature is not defined, and "creature" otherwise. {{#if:string|then="not empty"|else="empty"}} looks only for whether string is empty. If it's not empty, you get then; if it is empty, you get else. {{#if:{{{creature|Something}}}||something else}} will therefore only look for whether {{{creature|Something}}} is empty, and since "Something" is set as its default, it will never be empty. That means it will always take the action defined under then, which is blank (||), so nothing happens. Since the string is never empty, "Something else" can also never happen. Standard #if definition syntax includes the pipe ({{#if:{{{creature|}}}||}} rather than {{#if:{{{creature}}}||}}) so that the default value is empty, meaning that "something else" will run if the parameter is not defined at all. See functions in templates for more details. --Enodoc (talk) 12:21, 5 January 2016 (UTC)

I have been up all night, so my coding isn't at its best, but it seems to be working now... whatever I did, it is now putting the template when no image is defined, and no template otherwise. Jeancey (talk) 13:01, 5 January 2016 (UTC)

Hmm, maybe so, but I still don't like that syntax :P --Enodoc (talk) 15:03, 5 January 2016 (UTC)

(←) Whatever changes were made, it seems like the template is now incorrectly adding this category to every NPC page. —Legoless (talk) 16:07, 5 January 2016 (UTC)

Yeah, because the #if was never empty, it was calling {{Parameter Check|Creature}} on every NPC and every Creature page. I changed the syntax to what I believe it should be per the above; is it working now? --Enodoc (talk) 17:41, 5 January 2016 (UTC)

The category is gone at least. —Legoless (talk) 17:49, 5 January 2016 (UTC)

Sorry, that was indeed my code, and I'm really good at making the kind of error Enodoc mentioned. I agree that the #if should have been the way he suggested. What's the current status on this? – Robin Hood ^(talk) 19:56, 5 January 2016 (UTC)

Go a head and implement it. You know Template coding better than I do. I apologize for what I did last night, I did it at 5am my time. :P I was a tad bit tired. Jeancey (talk) 21:20, 5 January 2016 (UTC)

It looks like Enodoc did already, so I was just checking to make sure everything had been addressed. – Robin Hood ^(talk) 23:32, 5 January 2016 (UTC)

Category:Online-Marker BooksEdit

Hey Jeancey! I just noticed that Category:Online-Marker Books shows only a few member pages (six as of this writing), when there are in fact many more marking books than that. For example, this marker book for Mehrune's Spite in Auridon has all the correct information and even links to the category as it should, but the category itself doesn't have it. (See these too.) Could you take a look, please? —likelolwhat ^{talk lulzy to me} 06:48, 12 January 2016 (UTC)

That sort of thing is usually the result of multiple levels of transclusion. Typically, doing a null edit on whichever template(s) create the category will do the trick, but not always. MediaWiki has traditionally been a bit prone to breakage in this area. I've done a null edit, but it'll take a while for the wiki to go through all of the linked pages and update them, so don't be surprised if you don't see any difference until tomorrow. – Robin Hood ^(talk) 08:05, 12 January 2016 (UTC)

That fixed it. Jeancey (talk) 11:25, 12 January 2016 (UTC)

Per all other Cyrodiil questsEdit

Regarding this edit. If that's the case, then all other Cyrodiil quests need to be changed. All the quests in Cyrodiil (with the possible exception of Nirnroot Wine) have no Recommended Level, as the displayed journal level is always the same as your character level, and the gold reward is scaled to your level too (thus why I changed it from 160 to Leveled last year). --Enodoc (talk) 13:41, 20 January 2016 (UTC)

Just give me one perfect example of a completed Cyrodiil quest and I'll fix all the rest :P Jeancey (talk) 14:46, 21 January 2016 (UTC)

Heh, "perfect example". I just changed Black Dagger Supplies to what I think is the best current example. But I'm working on creating a template similar to {{ESO XP}} for gold, which should alleviate some of these issues, so then we'd need to change them all to use that :P I think we'd probably be best to wait until that's done, then we can have an editing spree of adding that new template to all the quests xD --Enodoc (talk) 17:26, 21 January 2016 (UTC)

Blinding Flashes and Radiant OppressionEdit

I noticed you had a bit of confusion over Blinding Flashes/Radiant Oppression. File:ON-icon-skill-Templar-Blinding Flashes.png needs to be moved to File:ON-icon-skill-Templar-Radiant Oppression.png, over the redirect. I created the redirect because I couldn't move the icon, then forgot to ask someone to move it ;P Thanks! --Enodoc (talk) 17:51, 24 February 2016 (UTC)

Sorry, I totally forgot about doing this! It is now done :P Jeancey (talk) 18:26, 6 March 2016 (UTC)

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