Online talk:Scribing

Rotating stock page creation requestEdit

I've put in a request to create ON:Script Vendors Rotating Stock/2024 at the New Pages request (here), in order to begin a list of the rotating stock at the scholarium and infinite archive. I'll update it once it's created and link here. Gegensmith (talk) 19:22, 14 June 2024 (UTC)

Apparently, I do have permission, so have begun a page here Online:Script Vendors Rotating Stock/2024 Gegensmith (talk) 19:36, 14 June 2024 (UTC)

We have three weeks so far, so too early to say there's a definite pattern, but scripts from IA are appearing at Scholarium one or two weeks subsequently.Gegensmith (talk)

ScribingEdit

Hi. Great work on the scribing pages. I've been adding and editing little bits there as I explore it (already done on EU, doing on NA). Do you happen to know whether the dungeon etc. coffers give a chance for all types of scripts? (I've had Affix scripts so far, but unsure whether any others). Also, one tiny grammar note (apologies for any pedantry): In a sentence with 'one thing' and 'another thing', no comma should appear after the "and"; in a list of three things -- 'one thing', 'another thing', and 'a third thing', commas can come after each 'thing' (though the second is a question of style rather than grammar). I also saw you added the item templates for the Sigils and I've started using those. If you have a moment, could you figure out what the template ought to be for ink? Many thanks Gegensmith (talk) 17:07, 14 June 2024 (UTC)

Can't say for sure whether it's all of them, I was following your lead on that one. I had theories that some might be PvP-only, but given that all of them seem to list both PvP and PvE sources, I don't believe that is the case. I've only been getting them from the guild quests, but I don't generally do PvP. Here's a Luminous Ink link. — TheRealLurlock (talk) 17:13, 14 June 2024 (UTC)

Great, thanks. I'll try to record my drops and amend it later. Gegensmith (talk) 17:45, 14 June 2024 (UTC)

Another question: I'm adding the prices for scripts. I'm using ESO Price template for the gold icon. I can't find one for ON:Archival Fortunes. Do you know if there is one, or where I would request its creation? Many thanks Gegensmith (talk) 18:05, 14 June 2024 (UTC)

Template:ESO_AF — TheRealLurlock (talk) 18:07, 14 June 2024 (UTC)

Great, thank you very much. Gegensmith (talk) 18:21, 14 June 2024 (UTC)

Hello again. Yes, the table for the cost of scripts looks much better. I wonder, if you have the time, could you please take a look at my attempt to create a page listing the rotating stock of the script vendors? I modelled it on the luxury furnishings vendor lists, but couldn't make everything work. Specifically, I can't work out how to get the date to appear in the final column -- I'm attempting to use a local date template, but can't see why they are invisible.

With regard to ink drop rates: I know from my experience on the EU server that the .5% isn't correct. Of course, there's no accounting for RNG... but, in my experience: far higher drop rate from nodes than enemies; higher for enchanting nodes, followed by alchemy nodes, then blacksmithing; higher in West Weald than other zones. I have loot log running which posts to chat whenever i get one or two but haven't collected data. But, from brief notes from one attempt to record: x2 @11:23am, x2 @ 11:24, x1 @ 11:27, x2 @ 11:48, etc. I'll put together a note for the article about CP perks increasing the rate too.

Many thanks, Gegensmith (talk) 21:16, 14 June 2024 (UTC)

Ugh, I'm not sure how that #localdate thing works. My template-fu is a bit rusty, and that's one of those more advanced features I never used. I'd just put it in as text, though of course then you're dealing with US vs. EU ordering on MM/DD/YYYY vs DD/MM/YYYY. I'd personally opt for UTC YYYY/MM/DD, that way they sort in proper chronological order no matter where you are. Of course, since the date is the same for each batch, maybe don't put it in its own column but in a header above each set of items? All I can say is I don't want to be responsible for keeping that thing up to date. It was bad enough with the luxury furnisher, where they only change once a month. It might be better to just say "Here's a list of all the things he could sell", along with prices, etc. but put a note saying that he'll only sell a limited subset of those items which varies from week to week. That's easier for Farandil than for Ool, of course, because Ool has a much wider pool of items to choose from. I'm just not sure it's worth the effort trying to keep up with an ever-changing stock like that.

Regarding ink drop - I heard that figure from several people online, and my own testing on NA seemed to back it up, but I wasn't being very scientific about it. I also heard that ZOS is considering increasing the rate due to many complaints. I hadn't heard that they were available outside the West Weald at all. I think this requires more rigorous testing. Isn't there an addon that tracks this across multiple users over long periods? One developed by our own Daveh in fact? I know there used to be at least... — TheRealLurlock (talk) 22:31, 14 June 2024 (UTC)

Thanks for the advice -- I've added the dates manually but retained individual dates, since the sort columns would mess up the grouped dates. Yes, it will be a bit of a pain at first to keep updated. But I'm assuming the stock will remain static -- at least for a good while (new grimoires, I expect, but not so sure about new scripts). I am also assuming that the stock between the two of them will come in 'bundles' (same ones always sold together), in which case I might make some templates (individual price scripts, then bundles grouping) so that only one template need be added each time. I used to edit wikipedia a great deal (featured articles on there, etc.) but that was a while ago, so my template abilities are a little limited -- ideally they'd have a toggle to show gold or IA currency, depending on the vendor -- but i'd need to do some more research before i can do that. I'll have a look for the add on you mentioned -- would be worth trying to pin down the figures. Someone in chat in a twitch stream confirmed ink dropping from PD bosses, so I added that. Gegensmith (talk) 14:56, 16 June 2024 (UTC)

PraiseEdit

Chiming in to heap additional praise on you, Lurlock. Great work getting all this info on the wiki so quickly. --Xyzzy ^Talk 10:15, 16 June 2024 (UTC)

Delve dropsEdit

Hello again. I see the addition of possible DLC zone delve quests. Sure, it won't hurt to confirm each, but there's no real reason to think they don't... I do think we need to have a list for ALL the sources for each script, since we don't want to create the impression that the delve is the only one to do -- we get three of each type guaranteed -- one from each type (delve, mage guild, reward of worthy, for focus). Is that what you meant by the up to three?

Also, it isn't a three max -- it's a three guaranteed; 25% chance after that (though one may hit the x50 repeatable limit at the extreme; but that's quests, not coffers)

Unless you're getting the three max from some other source? Gegensmith (talk) 17:13, 18 June 2024 (UTC)

Well, you can only do 1 Mages Guild quest per character per day, so that's already limited. It did seem like 3 was guaranteed for just delves, but I was unable to find any more after 3 from those. I did all 15 of them in one day and still only got 3 from the first 3 I did. It seems this limit only applies to the delves, as I got 4 including the Mages Guild. No idea on the PvP quests, I don't do those unless I have to. There is of course a hard limit, because I don't think you'll find any more scripts once you have them all? Not sure. I did not remove the other sources, I just broke the list out for the delve quests (doing the same for WB and incursions). It's a lot harder to test the WB and Incursion quests, as you need other people to help with those, and there's often just not enough people playing in the older DLC zones. As far as confirmation, I don't like to put information up there that is just a guess without clearly indicating this. It's entirely possible that they forgot to include some of these quest givers when adding the scripts to their drops, so I want to make sure that we mark things as unconfirmed until we know for sure. — TheRealLurlock (talk) 17:22, 18 June 2024 (UTC)

Well, firstly, remember that the drops come from opening a coffer, not from doing a quest. It is possible to accumulate coffers for each character and NOT open them. Mage's Guild quests, also, can be shared, so you can do more than one per day per character (I believe; maybe i'm thinking of Fighter's). I suspect that you just had really good rng from your delve coffers if you got three drops from delves in one day. It's only the first of each type that's guaranteed; 25% after that. I've been watching twitch streamers test this all last week. So, you can get a max of nine guaranteed drops per account per day -- one from each source. Beyond that, it's 25% chance from all nine sources. One tip, maybe for the page, maybe not: like you, I'm not fond of PVP. It's easy, though, to collect the six district IC quests off-peak time (easier on EU than NA); same for the Cyrodiil town quests. For the IC, prob want to keep the quest active and hand-in once per day (for the siege of cyrodiil merit, or whatever it's called). For the cyrodiil town quests, they can all be handed in and the coffers remain unopened. It's harder to accumulate rewards of the worthy (25,000AP per reward), but again it's possible to accumulate the coffers in one go and keep them unopened. As far as confirming the DLC zones -- the tooltip of the Sigils goes some way towards that -- it lists the three sources. But, again, no harm in awaiting confirmation. Gegensmith (talk) 17:48, 18 June 2024 (UTC)

It was 2 days in a row, I did the same thing, all 15 delve quests. The first 3 gave scripts both times, the remaining 12 did not. I think that's highly unlikely to be a coincidence. I have not done the same with WB and incursion quests due to the difficulties of getting enough people in older zones, and I don't touch the PvP stuff (especially IC), so I don't know. I play exclusively on NA, so it might be different than EU. I suppose I could try the IC thing on the PTS, but that's a lot of time to waste on stuff you don't get to keep. I've otherwise found it to be a thoroughly unpleasant place at the best of times, unless you can get a large crew together. — TheRealLurlock (talk) 20:03, 18 June 2024 (UTC)

Ok, that's interesting. I'll give it a try on my account today and get back to you. I have learnt that the rnd does seem to guarantee a script and scrap per CHARACTER, but am going to test that further today. BTW, I hope it's ok with you, but I thought I'd copy this convo to the talk page of scribing and continue there, just so others can reference easily. Please let me know if not and I'll undo it. Gegensmith (talk) 20:37, 18 June 2024 (UTC)

OK, so I've just tested the delve quest coffer drops. Focus scripts drop from daily delve, mage's guild, and rewards for the worthy. Today, I claimed one from a West Weald delve quest on one character. I swapped characters and did the delve daily for West Weald again. No drop from that (and none claimed today yet from Mage or Reward for Worthy). It may be that delve guarantees a drop for the first three DIFFERENT ZONE quests. I'll try another zone now and report back. Gegensmith (talk) 21:26, 18 June 2024 (UTC)

Reporting back: On the second character, I've just done the delve quest from Northern Elsweyr and NO drop. Looks like your two days may have been rng after all. I'll try another zone delve quest to confirm for sure. Gegensmith (talk) 22:08, 18 June 2024 (UTC)

Reporting back again: So, I've just done the Gold Coast delve daily and NO drop. I chose GC since it's a 'confirmed' in the list. So, the drops are as I said. I've been getting x9 guaranteed (x8 on days when no Rewards for Worthy) every day since launch, so it is as I've put in the article. I'll adjust the section to reflect that. Gegensmith (talk) 22:18, 18 June 2024 (UTC)

Hiding numbers and Using ScriptsEdit

Oh, I didn't know about that hide template for the numbering required to arrange by script-type -- that's nice, I'll add it to the rotating stock page too.

I saw the edits clarifying "learn" rather than "use". We do need to clarify a little further, though. Yes, you're right, it's not necessary to "use" a script to scribe a skill -- but, in order to learn it, the player has to either double click the script (on PC, not sure about console) or to right-click it and select from the drop-down menu "Use". I'll have a think about a good wording that will avoid confusion without becoming (as is most likely) too verbose. Gegensmith (talk) 18:12, 20 June 2024 (UTC)

Benefits from Wing of Crow Quest?Edit

Do you know the other rewards/benefits/additions to scribing system that come with the Wing of the Crow quest? The tooltips (here and ingame) for the collectibles for the others says what you get, but I can't remember if there were additions with the final quest. I've done all of them on PC EU and am halfway thru the questline on NA, so I'll watch closely myself when I get to it there -- but, if you know already, please add to the Quests subsection. Gegensmith (talk) 18:17, 20 June 2024 (UTC)

Speculation about ultimate scribed skillEdit

At the bottom of the page is the following note:

An NPC in West Weald, Tribune Alea Idolus, uses what appears to be a modified version of a Trample-based skill (summoning three golden horses to attack) that may signal that ultimate abilities are planned for a future release.

While it is true that Alea uses an attack with 3 horses, I have no idea how that would imply anything whatsoever about ultimate abilities. Many NPCs have unique attacks not available to the player, and her trample-like skill seems no more powerful than the already available Trample skill (in fact it's considerably less powerful, as most NPC skills are), which is notably not an ultimate. This seems like completely unfounded speculation which should probably be removed. (Mentioning Alea's special ability may be of note, though probably not on this page. It's definitely worth noting on her NPC page and maybe on the Trample page, but not here. But any speculation that it might say something about ultimate abilities should be removed as it's entirely baseless. — TheRealLurlock (talk) 05:13, 26 July 2024 (UTC)

Well, it may appear baseless if we ignore the bases for the claim: it is an upgraded version of the Trample grimoire (the mount attack appears nowhere else in the game except the player's scribed skill and this NPC); she attacks with three golden horses rather than a single mount (a notably more visually stunning effect, mirroring the relation between ordinary skills and ultimates); as you say, the power of the NPC's skill relative to the players is no basis for dismissing the idea, since all NPC attacks operate at this kind of level; the scribing system has no ultimate skills currently, but given developer's comments about future expansion, it is not unreasonable to anticipate ultimate (or, indeed, class skills and other skill-line Grimoires, such as Psijic) skills will be introduced later. The comment is in a footnote and clearly indicates its nature as a idea about future development, rather than a confirmed fact, as does the other footnote in the article. The link to the NPC's page allows any browsers to locate the character and judge for themselves. That the form of attack only appears in these two places in the game is significant enough to warrant noting, I'd suggest. Gegensmith (talk) 12:14, 8 August 2024 (UTC)