Skyrim talk:First Time Players

To doEdit

I think this article should vaguely cover most of the mechanics of the game in some way, so new players have links to explore the wiki, if they so desire to delve deeper. It should not list everything in the same organized fashion as the main page, but sections should be in chronological order, as to not spoil story for players just rolling a new character, or so players with a bit of experience can skip over the basic controls.

I will suggest a few things which could probably benefit this article:

• movement and combat controls, selecting spells, inventory management (equipping better weapons, encumbrance)
• possibly a short description of skills, some eluding to shouts without spoilers (the prophesized Dragonborn to come; a hero born with the power of The Voice, ...)
• looting, hanging on to ingredients which will be useful later on, how to go about collecting bees or how many Rusted Iron Clubs are too many...
• crafting, cooking makes things tastier, it's good to know enhancements can be overwritten when skill improves, disenchanting
• brief section on factions and disposition
• Magic Effects, and what causes them (potions etc)
• Souls
• Combat for brief descriptions of criticals, power attacks, ranged weaponry, different quality materials and enchantments
• Quests, how do they work?
• Character creation "builds" which will help guide new players as far as races and the early skill perks for commonly combined skills. I'm thinking "heavy combat", stealth, pure magic, magic combat hybrid, sort of generic builds with a few choices, not huge long lists with all the details.
• leveled lists, dungeon/place level locking, cleared dungeons
• companions
• horses
• console commands and modding

Lukish_ Tlk Cnt 15:09, 28 November 2011 (UTC)

Can I suggest that also added to here is how to make your first 5,000 coin relatively fast without following the main quest? Such as going to join the companions. The first errand you are sent on to be accepted gets a good 2,000 with a good stash of loot and XP, with the safety of a member of the circle to help out! (Saddy85 22:49, 27 December 2011 (UTC))

Yeah, go ahead and add it in there, never wait for someone else to do it, as then it probably will take a month for anyone to read and actually try your suggestions. If you want a quick second opinion, I heartily recommend the chatroom. — Unsigned comment by Lukish (talk • contribs) at 23:47 on 19 January 2012 (GMT)

Hints already existsEdit

I'm glad we have so much effort adding to this page, and correcting (mostly my) errors, but let's not make this a dumping ground for hints and tips, it's supposed to be a short, succinct guide for new players, not a place to define what "equipment" means or where we discuss the merits of which skill 100 perk to choose later in the game. For a place to do that, see Hints. Lukish_ Tlk Cnt 06:45, 30 November 2011 (UTC)

something i've foundEdit

It is easier to get full set of heavy armour by following Ralof (until bandit camp north of stones which has a set).

also, more of an exploit, you can hit and cast destruction on Ralof/Hadvar and it counts toward xp — Unsigned comment by Zzr (talk • contribs) at 21:05 on 4 December 2011 (GMT)

The first one would be good to have as a note just make sure you word it properly, the second point would be better for the destruction page.RIM 21:06, 4 December 2011 (UTC)

BlockingEdit

The warrior player example states that you can block with a one handed weapon without a shield ,I've been playing for a bit and have not found how this is possible nor is it listed in the [Skyrim:controls|] section on the site. Originally I had it posted otherwise, but someone changed it ,just wondering if I'm completely missing an important part of the game haha. Chimo. 02:50, 7 December 2011 (UTC) ^{(Originally replaced by the following answer. Readded by MortenOSlash (talk) 22:30, 31 January 2013 (GMT) for completeness)}

It is possible to block with a one handed weapon and no shield (same button), but it is impossible to block when using two one handed weapons. — Unsigned comment by 96.231.154.79 (talk) at 20:06 on 8 December 2011 (GMT)

Correct. What is your point? Do you have a question regarding it? Eric Snowmane 20:07, 8 December 2011 (UTC)

Nevermind the problem was corrected , thanks anyways. Chimo. 02:48, 10 December 2011 (UTC)

Combination ClassEdit

Although this play style is rarely mentioned;I think it is important that players dont feel like they have to choose one path or another when it comes to choosing your play style. It is possible to even powers out so that you may play a caster or warrior or thief at anytime you choose. If you do this however I would suggest building up the playstyle you think you will be using the most and then build on the other trees you wish to improve on later. This will make it easier on you earlier on in the game so that you will be able to to fight more effeciently. — Unsigned comment by 70.43.0.66 (talk) at 19:06 on 7 December 2011 (UTC)

A CommentEdit

The "Character Creation" section reads like there is a big difference between the races as far as play style is concerned. I get the feel from reading it that a Dunmer or Redguard, for instance, should not be a mage. Yet, both races have some bonuses to magic skills.

From my experience playing Skyrim and Oblivion, the skill bonuses seem to make a relatively minor difference in Skyrim compared to Oblivion. Also, many of the racial powers seem more a matter of flavor for the race than something that actually has a large impact on game playing. For instance all of the additional racial spells can be bought cheaply in Whiterun or found before getting that far. They are certainly not game-changing.

The Powers seem to be more significant than skill bonuses. At least they seem that way to me. Most of the racial powers would benefit a range of player approaches. For example, anyone that uses Magic even as a backup skill would benefit from the Altmer racial. Any play style should benefit from Histskin. Mudeye 22:04, 14 December 2011 (UTC)

I agree with you, I didn't write that section. You can edit it to include the fact that race makes little difference if you want. The part about what race to choose for certain character types is just a suggestion though.RIM 22:12, 14 December 2011 (UTC)

Battle MageEdit

Does Battle Mage need its own category? You have to be reasonably high level before any non-cloth armor shows up with manacost-reducing benefits, and you'd have to powerlevel enchanting, gaining quite a few levels, to make any useful Destruction-based armor. Weight will also be a problem at low levels because Stamina is no benefit in combat, so carrying capacity won't increase as armor weight does. Once a player has a few high-skill perks it becomes much more fun. I suspect that if a new player tried to wear heavy armor at lvl 1, they'd give up by lvl 10. However a lvl 20-30 mage with the right perks might switch to heavy armor and never look back. I'd suggest adding a line extolling the virtues of switching to heavy armor later in the game should be added to the Mage category; and the benefit to Destruction magic in using dual-casting applies to all mages, so it should go up there as well. I shrink from making such heavy-handed changes by myself to someone else's work without discussing it first. NFR 18:35, 16 December 2011 (UTC)

That leads down a path you do not want to take in an overview. I would not mind an area where we could outline build and playstyle guidelines for, say, the original game classes like battlemage or spellsword or whatever, but it does not belong here anymore than a special guide on how to make an unarmed specialist belongs here.

Early on a mage has to make some decisions: what stone to use (leveling bonus or travel far to get extra magic or astronach or something?), what armor to use, and how to fight. It can be exceptionally difficult to try to play a pure mage by using flames while wearing just robes and a hood. It is very easy to summon a sword and beat things to death while wearing armor and a shield. I think we do NEED a section to describe magical based builds and tactics and approaches, but not here, at the most put a link to it here (along with a link to warrior and rogue based builds, perhaps). The subject is too complex and really should have its own page. By the way, the historic battlemage had little armor but carried heavy weapons in case his magic ran out... but skyrim seems to be designed for magic users to draw from conjuration AND destruction for combat, rather than just the one school, so I highly recommend using the 3 summoned sword perks to powerlevel enchanting & conjuration first and build up destruction on the side, maybe by using flames in your off hand.

I will say that the comment that mages usually wear light or no armor is odd. Why not heavy, is it the extra weight on a low stamina build? I would change it to this: "Mages often wear robes that support magic use over regular armor, though player-enchanted armor can replace the robes if the player has a high enchanting skill". And leave it at that. — Unsigned comment by 66.18.49.84 (talk) at 16:16 on 10 January 2012

Actually the whole builds thing may need a looking at. Your build is really just your perks, and a new player cannot understand that by reading this section, it bogs the reader down in things like what armor you might choose to use in your particular character concept, which is mostly nonsense (armor type is largely unimportant, so is weapon choice, or how many scrolls someone might carry).

The stuff that is there can be useful as an example but what the player needs to know are 2 things:

1) perks + race ARE the build and

1.B) race is fairly minor for anyone except the uberplayer who wants to max out everything and

2) With only 40-50 perks for a typical player (typical players are not going to max out all the skills to reach level 80...) the path and build for the character should be carefully considered early on so perks are not wasted.

From there the existing things might be listed to give 3 examples... something like..

the typical thief player may want to look at perks in 1h weapons, stealth, illusion, light armor, pickpocketing, or archery. An assassin style might take up assassin's blade and critical hits with bows while using illusion magic to remain hidden. Or something to describe a typical warrior or typical mage build. But it needs to be a lot more clear that the perks are what make it happen. — Unsigned comment by 66.18.49.84 (talk) at 16:42 on 10 January 2012

More accurately Perks + Race + what you plan on doing with Extra Effect is the build, since the goal of 100 Enchanting/Extra Effect is the one thing common to any and all builds across the board. Enchantments play a much larger role in your character's performance than their race does too, though Perks are still the most important consideration overall. — Unsigned comment by 206.76.160.254 (talk) at 18:54 on 3 February 2012

Phrase to live byEdit

I've noticed that one thing repeatedly saves my skin, setting things on fire. (Flames) So I was wondering if any one else has phrases to live by and if they, collectively, could be worth adding?Chronic 08:16, 9 February 2012 (UTC)

Encyclopedia format whenever possible, please. Guidance needs to be constructive. I don't think "set things on fire" qualifies. Minor Edits^{Threats•Evidence} 08:40, 9 February 2012 (UTC)

Sorry, I was on my phone at the time. Generally the phrase I use is "If unsure, test." Whats the easiest way to test something in skyrim? By using a spell on it most of the time. Such as maybe seeing the faint outlines of a rune, which will be triggered by another spell fired at it. Or unsure whether or not a draugr is really dead or not, which will also wake up if provoked with something.Chronic 20:50, 11 February 2012 (UTC)

valuable/invaluableEdit

Since that word has gone back and forth, I'll state that I agree with 108.7.161.242's change. Invaluable is akin to saying "I don't know what I would do without it". Not that "it's been a help and is something I couldn't buy". There are thirteen different stones, each one isn't invaluable. Heck, I wouldn't even call the guardian stone ones that valuable. "Nice" maybe. This wiki? Invaluable. Clairvoyance if you have the compass and markers turned off? Invaluable. A Daedric artifact? Valuable. -Vardis 01:59, 17 February 2012 (UTC)

I don't know, Warrior with Smithing, invaluable. Mage with enchanting, invaluable. Even Theif and Alchemy, invaluable. Lover stone is just valuable though.--Br3admax 02:04, 17 February 2012 (UTC)

I can see the argument for 'invaluable', but also the argument against it. So I changed it to 'useful', which is how I would describe the guardian stone effects. --Gaebrial 12:37, 17 February 2012 (UTC)

I have to admit that I don't really have much of a preference for one over the other. I could even see a rational argument that using the stone could potentially be a bad idea for a first time player. Leveling too fast, especially before we have a chance to figure out our priorities, can actually have a negative impact on the game! In all honesty, what I did not like about that edit was that it undid someone's work with a reason that seemed condescending and lecturing (and it was wrong, or at least not any more right). In fact, both words have numerous senses and are variously defined in dictionaries. In the Cambridge Dictionaries Online (American English), "invaluable" is defined simply as "extremely useful" [1]. To me, it's fine to make an edit if we think that something's better than what's there, even if we are not 100% sure. But some of these professorial, "let me teach you something" kinds of changes just look like someone is showing off. I don't like it--whether it is right or wrong! But ... well, now if I really look at it honestly, I see that I didn't do much better myself. My own action was um, well, pretty much the same thing as what I just said I didn't like. Maybe I need a hug. The only good thing that I see coming out of all of this is a discussion here of opinions, starting with Vardis explaining his thoughts instead of just changing it with a "this isn't right" edit summary, Br3admax's plainly-stated thoughts, and Gaebrial's simple and honest explanation for the decision he made. So, wait, I'm back to congratulating myself, then. Yay!! --JR^{Talk E-mail} 15:03, 17 February 2012 (UTC)

Skyrim for Morrowind/Oblivion playersEdit

Just a question (and maybe a suggestion?) - on the Morrowind and Oblivion pages, there is an article called Morrowind for Oblivion Players (and vice versa on the Oblivion page), detailing the biggest differences between the two games and the mechanics used. I was wondering if there is a "Skyrim for Oblivion Players" (or Morrowind) in the works ATM? And if not, I'd like to throw the suggestion out there, if for no other reason than site consistency (though the Oblivion for Morrowind Players page helped me a lot when I started on Oblivion). I would work on it myself, but my rapidly aging CPU simply won't run Skyrim, so I'm out of the loop til that is corrected (hopefully at the end of next month if plans work out! woohoo!) DextroWombat 00:31, 17 March 2012 (UTC)

Edit: Scratch all that, I've started on it! At this point, it's in a sandbox, and all I've got is a few of the tables filled out. I have a lot of unanswered questions, though, so if anyone wants to help, go here. DextroWombat 06:04, 17 March 2012 (UTC)

Update: The page is up, and has been moved here: General:Differences Between Morrowind, Oblivion, and Skyrim

--ABCface^◥ 21:46, 24 April 2012 (UTC)

Master DifficultyEdit

Are you sure about the fact that at master difficulty the damage taken is 2x? Because I have 170 HP and 15% shock resistance and I died for a Shock Rune!! Can someone check it please? --87.8.21.79 07:50, 11 April 2012 (UTC)

A shock rune does 50 shock damage but enemies who have perks could have perks that increase shock damage. If you double that damage it could easily kill you, especially at a low level. I didn't add the part about master difficulty though. RIM 11:48, 11 April 2012 (UTC)

Starting OutEdit

Perhaps the info in the above section are out of date, or maybe I totally missed it. I just started a new character (my 4th) and finally decided to follow the guidance (lol). Anyway, this page references a skill book and a treasure map found at the bandit camp just south of the guardian stones. I don't see either item in that camp. Can anyone confirm, and if so edit the page accordingly? --72.88.199.175 04:04, 28 July 2012 (UTC)

I just checked it out. The camp was definitely there, as were the satchel and the skill book. --Xyzzy^Talk 04:13, 28 July 2012 (UTC)

Agree, sorry. I found it. I was confusing the bandit camp south for the hunter camp west, which can be seen from the stones. --72.88.199.175 04:36, 28 July 2012 (UTC)

Stamina and carry weightEdit

Stamina doesn't affect carry weight. Increasing your stamina does not increase your carry weight, and conversely, decreasing your stamina does not decrease your carry weight. In Oblivion, carry weight was affected by attributes, principally Strength, but in Skyrim it's completely separate. The only time they're linked is when you level up.

Otherwise vampires would lose carry weight in the daytime, diseases that affected maximum stamina would cause you to lose carry weight, and so on. (Imagine if current stamina affected carry weight. That would be insane.)

Yes, I know most of this seems obvious to us editors, but this page is for newbies; we shouldn't assume they know as much as we do. --Morrolan (talk) 23:41, 18 April 2013 (GMT)

One minor detail -- Skyrim:Loading_Screens#Leveling. Since it is the most common way new players will in fact end up increasing their stamina, they will also see their carrying capacity increase. -83.128.72.185 00:31, 19 April 2013 (GMT)

I just tested it by leveling my alchemy until I leveled up. My carry weight was 435 before I leveled. I chose to increase my Stamina, and my carry weight increased to 440. I tried using the console command "player.setav stamina" to increase my stamina, and hence my carry weight, and my carry weight did not increase. It seems to be solely tied to the increase in stamina while leveling. --Xyzzy ^Talk 01:16, 19 April 2013 (GMT)

Ok. I see what you're saying. I based my wording off the loading screen, while your edit was more descriptive. --Xyzzy ^Talk 01:20, 19 April 2013 (GMT)

Yeah, believing loading screens can be fatal to wiki accuracy. Unless you're trying to document the loading screens themselves, a number of them lie. Can't say I blame you, the loading screen for the Lady Stone fooled me into thinking it was useless for ages. --Morrolan (talk) 03:36, 20 April 2013 (GMT)

This page rambles way too much.Edit

It seems to me at least to be really a disorganized bunch of facts about Skyrim, not really a guide to the game. I'm not even sure what its intended focus is supposed to be: is it directed at people who've never played Bethesda games before, people who've never played ES games before, or old gamers (like me) playing Skyrim?

If it's really going to be directed at newbies then a lot of the details need to be stripped out. Newbies need to be told in no uncertain terms that skill usage, shouts and perk selection will determine how their characters work, and given a lot more information about what kinds of things they should be looking for, especially on the perk screen which is a very messy hybrid of Fallout and Oblivion.

Right now there's really nothing about shouts, which, yes, they're not there right at the very beginning, but are a huge part of Skyrim. Meanwhile there's info about legendary skills which... sigh. It has a bunch of information about races, which to be completely honest I would prefer to see replaced with something along the lines of "the differences between races are extremely minor, if you want to play a particular race because you think it looks good then do it." Most races have a few 20 skills, but leveling a skill you're using from 15 to 20 will happen on its own very quickly, usually during Unbound (unless it's a crafting skill). --Morrolan (talk) 01:02, 17 May 2013 (GMT)

If you want to build a sandbox with a cut-down page, I'd be very willing to look over it and give my thoughts. Vely^►t►e 01:30, 17 May 2013 (GMT)

OK, that's on my to-do list for the next time the weather's really awful. It's been gorgeous here which is slowing down my UESP use a lot. --Morrolan (talk) 16:09, 19 May 2013 (GMT)

Well, I've started it here: User:Morrolan/First Time Players Sandbox although the weather's been still really nice. It still seems too big to me, I'm going to work on chopping it down more. --Morrolan (talk) 01:54, 21 June 2013 (GMT)

Scope of Difficulty LevelsEdit

When playing on difficulty levels other than Adept, does the increase/decrease in damage dealt & received also apply to your followers, and to creatures you summon/raise? Example: Playing on Master, and Kharjo is with me. . .does he also take double damage? If I conjure an Atronach, does it take double damage? Common sense suggests the answer is "no", but clarification would be nice. Thanks. 76.185.41.201 21:04, 26 July 2013 (GMT)

I haven't put a query into the CK people yet, but it really does not appear to be the case. No NPCs or creatures, including followers and conjured creatures, seem to be affected by difficulty in the slightest which makes Conjuration and Illusion much more powerful at higher difficulty levels relative to other skills. --Morrolan (talk) 00:34, 28 July 2013 (GMT)

That's what I was thinking. I'm giving Legendary mode a go, using lots of Fury and summons. It ain't pretty so far. Thanks for the response. 76.185.41.201 05:38, 28 July 2013 (GMT)